I am not ready to quit TV Tropes yet

Vorpy

Solution:

force new accounts to read the rules (one that has had all the input ever needed to make sure that there are no things that aren't mentioned) before they are ever allowed to make an account.

ClockworkUniverse

The problem with that, though, is when you ask people to read something before joining, they scroll to the bottom and click through.

Vorpy

Put something in the rules that, if they don't do it, their accounts won't be accepted.

Like "check the box in the far right corner to confirm you have read the rules" midway into a paragraph, and have the checkbox hidden in the corner of the screen, or have a secret button hidden that they will only know where it is if they have read the rules.

That, or make a waiting sentence happen before they are allowed to check the box, like one minute or something so they can use that spare time to read the rules.

Either way, there are going to be one hundred million instances of people ignoring this or finding a way around it and getting onto the site without knowing shit about how to do rules, but they should be implemented anyway, because if they don't have a long enough attention span to READ THE FUCKING RULES, they shouldn't be allowed to easily make an account.

glennmagusharvey

Some program installers force you to scroll to the bottom of their EULA in order to be able to check their box.

Central Avenue

What I find funny are the installers that force you to scroll down before clicking "Accept", but also include a big "Scroll Down" button that you can just click a few times.

MillerCross

So, I've bit of a random question

How many of us have quit on TvT? And if so, can you state why? Try to be as nice and elaborate as possible, please.

Forzare

I quit.

In no particular order:
    -I don't like most of the userbase.
    -I don't like most of the mods.
    -I don't like the site's culture.
    -I don't like a lot of the policies.
    -I've utterly stopped caring about the wiki.

MillerCross

Thanks.

Also, a question I forgot to add:

How do you feel about the wiki's approach to media? Do you care?

Forzare

Do you mean No Such Thing As Notability?  Or the concept of tropes in general?

Crimson

I haven't actually fully quit Tv Tropes. I stopped defending and improving the wiki, but I still haven't broken my habit of browsing it or posting on the forums.

Why I did it is because what SA is saying about TV Tropes is right. Worse yet, the community and the administration has proven to have absolutely no interest in listening to those criticisms. And any attempts I have personally made (the bra sizes article notwithstanding) have been slapped back into my face. Therefore, I don't want to try and help a site that doesn't want to help itself. Simple as that.

MillerCross

Do you mean No Such Thing As Notability? Or the concept of tropes in general?

Both.

Forzare

I'm kind of of two minds about NSTAN.  On one hand, with a media site like TV Tropes, it seems like kind of a foggy gray area to say "This work is notable, and this work is not."

But on the other hand, you get huge pages extolling how awesome really creepy works are, with no negativity to balance it out.

On tropes: I think it could be a good idea, but it's kind of wasted potential.  Listing and explaining literary themes, trends, stuff like that seems like a good idea.  Mindlessly cataloging little details seems pointless and unnecessary.

MillerCross

Kthnx. Your contribution has been noted. 

IanExMachina

I only hang around in OTC (I know, I know) I never really bother with any other forum or the wiki itself unless to add/update pages on British Tv series.

Central Avenue

But on the other hand, you get huge pages extolling how awesome really creepy works are, with no negativity to balance it out.

Personally, I think that's less of a problem with NSTAN and more a problem with the fact that we are only allowed to like things.

ClockworkUniverse

^Technically, we aren't allowed to gush about stuff on the wiki. It's just really badly-enforced.

Central Avenue

I don't think the problem is so much that "no gushing" isn't enforced as it is that "no negativity" is enforced.

Forzare

^^ Eh.  If a rule isn't being enforced, it's not really any different than not having the rule.

MillerCross

Yup. Also, it's not technically. We aren't allowed to do it, period. 

Anyway, as I've mentioned before, we should all take a lesson from wikipedia and write our articles neutrally. That way, we don't have to outright say something is bad. What we should do is let words speak for themselves.

glennmagusharvey

I like the wiki.

Yes, cataloguing lots of little details--sometimes rather stupidly such as "basically every glasses-wearing girl in animé"--is more fan-indulging than actually useful for analysis.  But I don't think that's necessarily a bad thing; heck, what if I'm an artist and specifically looking for glasses-wearing animé girls for inspiration?

Even if that's pointless, I'm willing to let it slide because of its much greater value as a place for cataloguing devices used in creative work as well as metatextual devices and audience trends.  These are really interesting things to read about.

I like NSTAN because it means that I can create work pages for, like, every obscure thing that I know about.  And I know a number of obscure things.

Vorpy

I quit because:
- The majority of the userbase are people who suffer from opinion myopia, and cannot fathom why people enjoy things
- There are very few people in the gray areas when it comes to hyperbole and ambiguousness.
- I have nothing new to add to the wiki that I would spend time on writing, such as the Work Pages for Poison Apples, Fluorescent Black, Royo - Dead Moon, 1941 - Bisette and Veitch, Borgia, Imago, and Demon Wind. Since I am probably the only one on TVT who even knows they exist.
- The overdosage on sarcasm is absolutely disgusting, and how every response to something that the other party does not like is sarcastic and snide metagarbage, and most attitudes and pages on here encourage this.
- The drama is not worth getting angry over, nor are the discussions involved with them.
- The fun is being forced INTO the site, as opposed to being sucked out.
- The Trope Repair Shop is impossible to work with if you haven't been there long, and most of the decisions declared by them are questionable.
- There is no definitive banning procedure, and bans can be set out at whims.
- Metameta jokes.
- There are more interesting places to discuss the things I like.

Vivi

Pretty much what Vorpy said. Wish I had more to add.

glennmagusharvey

I haven't noticed an "overdosage on sarcasm".

Forzare

snark

so much snark

Vivi

I notice it so so so much. Passive aggressive attitudes are secreted from its HTML.

MillerCross

Have you ever seen the Lit Crit page, GMH?

Before it was nuked, it had a deliberately sarcastic description of what Literary Criticism was.

That's all I'll say on the matter.

vacasama

Yes, cataloguing lots of little details--sometimes rather stupidly such
as "basically every glasses-wearing girl in animé"--is more
fan-indulging than actually useful for analysis.  But I don't think
that's necessarily a bad thing; heck, what if I'm an artist and
specifically looking for glasses-wearing animé girls for inspiration?

I don't know.  I find the idea of cataloging "tropes" just for the sake of cataloging seems to be excessively anal.

Vorpy

I think it's less like a catalog, and more like a listing agency.

I used to list the different kinds of crayons in the world, and apparently, in 2001, there were 641 different colors of crayons.

ninjaclown

It's too harsh on people like us, and too light on people who keep subtly trolling like people on OTC. I just don't understand how WE became the bad guys one day.

ClockworkUniverse

subtly

?