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Comments
Is it so different you had to post six times about it?
Probably some glitch that happened when Nohay hit post comment.
It's official, Valve is invading our living rooms. Not that that's a bad thing, it's good for a lazy ass like me who's not willing to shell out for a custom made PC.
What I don't get is why people want to use controllers for games like platformers and stuff.
They're far easier to control with keyboard than with controller. On a controller I only get to use maybe max four fingers to control stuff. I have two thumbs that have to move everywhere and then maybe two index fingers.
But if I use keyboard I get to use all ten fingers to control stuff. Makes lots of combos FAR easier. Need a charged attack? Hold down C. Jumping at the same time? Hold down C while pressing X to jump. Dash jump? Hold down C to keep the charge while pressing Z followed smoothly by X.
For platforming, controllers are typically easier for me on account of having more control over direction -- if you even need more than 2-3 thumb buttons and a couple shoulders for most combat, the game isn't designed that well.
FPS, you pretty much have to use a mouse for turning/aiming speed.
Also, many keyboards will drop inputs if you push more than three keys at once, or certain combinations. Logitech has bugs where it won't recognize W+D+Space, for instance, and I have issues playing co-op games with a friend because sometimes the computer just tells us to fuck off when we both have to jump diagonally, and one of us ends up jumping straight up. This is called ghosting. It's inherent to the hardware structure of a keyboard, and controllers sidestep it completely.
Finger positioning for one. Holding a controller feels more natural for me. And the reason I don't like keyboard layouts like what you described is that the finger use gets really busy and trip over each other.
On the other hand I've actually been unhappy with the fact that i have to use my thumbs to control everything on controllers. I feel that games like Mega Man X are significantly easier when I play them on keyboard than on controller because I can have much more fine-tuned control over the individual button-presses. For example, I can turn around on a dime by switching between my index and ring fingers of my right hand, while I have to move a chunk of my hand in order to do that on a controller.
I wonder if part of the reason has to do with my playing the piano, though.
As for ghosting, I haven't had a problem with keyboards ghosting out combinations of ZXSC/AD yet. I guess I'm lucky.
See I can turn faster with the thumb because it's just one finger I'm moving a slight distance along the d-pad.
I find controllers MUCH MUCH better for platformers and beat em ups, mainly for button placement, vibration, analogue movement, and the general shape of the controller.
Yeah, I can't play those. Not in the least because developers can never seem to decide what order they want the keys in, and only about half of them let you remap it to something consistent. So in addition to inherent issues, you also have muscle memory of every other such game you've played fucking you up.
There's something to be said for having to hit jump/dash/fire all at once, but we have shoulder buttons now.
^ Ooh, I forgot about button-mashing. Yeah, you can't do the vibration thing on a keyboard.
Am I seriously deep in the minority on this issue? Wow, I didn't expect that. I thought the benefits of keyboard over controller would be really obvious...
Also, a keyboard has one degree of sensitivity. It's not typically an issue with FPS's, but in platformers you don't always want to go full-tilt.
I mean, think about stuff like the cluster of tiny platforms in the volcano in Mario 64. I would not want to do that on a keyboard. Ever.
> It's not typically an issue with FPS's, but in platformers you don't always want to go full-tilt.
Wait...what?! I thought it was the other way around--in FPS games you don't always want to go full-tilt, but in platformers, you either move or you don't move, and your jump height is normally determined by how long you hold down the jump button (up to your jump max of course).
Or maybe it's just 3D games where you don't want to go full-tilt, rather than FPSes, since you pointed out Mario 64. I've always remarked that one of the biggest anti-piracy measures in N64 games is the fact that they use a joystick--simply requiring a joystick controller for proper gameplay, and mucking it up otherwise (you can't really do the flying parts competently with a fixed-tilt keyboard setting, even if that tilt is not full tilt) prevents a lot of players from replacing the proper game with a computer-based equivalent substitute.
Now I've done pretty much all my platforming experience in 2D, not surprisingly (as most platformers are 2D games), and the rules I mentioned above for platformers apply to 2D games. So maybe I'm just lacking perspective.
Really, the only reason I'm holding out on buying more PC platformers is because keyboard is a dreadful way to control one, especially if it requires a lot of precision, like Super Meat Boy. And I just find D-pads and analog sticks easier.
Okay, yeah, I am pretty genuinely confused at why people think that controllers can be better than keyboard for 2D platformers. It's like I'm heading in one direction, everyone else is heading in another direction, and the two raysof thought are oblique, and if only someone could move them to be in the same plane, they'd intersect.
Okay, play Super Meat Boy with arrow keys and no way to regulate speed at a granular level. See how far you get.
ninjas everywhere
I find controllers more comfortable for just about everything except FPSes. And, like, RTSes, but those don't count.
I haven't, but I've played some similarly difficult games such as An Untitled Story and various Knytt Stories levels. Though I will say that I'm not really any good at super-hard platformers, mostly because I lack the patience to practice them.
Not going to try Super Meat Boy right now, butWell I don't own Super Meat Boy (nor do I plan on buying it because I like neither the genre of gameplay nor the art style) but I just started playing the original Meat Boy and I'm at the second Salt Factory stage now.The controls are pretty good. Nice and responsive. The movement physics, on the other hand...this boy controls like a slippery piece of wet meat...which I presume he is. The jump physics aren't actually that bad; it's the movement physics, where he just slides out of control, even in mid-air.
I also don't like the trial-and-error nature of these games, but that's a different story (and the reason why I prefer games like Spelunky, that have a lower difficulty in each playthrough but generate their content randomly and thus make the game less about memorizing and perfectly reproducing a certain set of keystrokes (or button inputs in your case) and more about learning the skills to deal with varying situations and survive them.
The original Meat Boy actually wasn't that nasty. I mean it was hard, but reasonable. It didn't get absurd until the marathons that the map pack and Super turned into.
Make that the third salt factory level, which I'm skipping. Did beat the fourth one (the one with the accelerators), and am currently working on Twin Towers.
And this doesn't feel really worth my effort.
Sounds like even more not my type of game.
So I've now completed just less than half the game; leaving 3, 5, 6, and 15 of Chapter 2 of 4 undone, and not having touched Chapter 3 or Chapter 4 at all. I'm okay with stopping here.
The only issue with playing this on keyboard is that I'll inevitably leave these ugly splotches of skin grime on and around certain keys after precision-mashing them in games like these. Of course, if this were a controller, the skin grime would be all over that instead, so it's not a keyboard-versus-controller issue.
I greatly prefer keyboard and mouse for most games, but controllers are much better when it comes to certain genres (platformers, beat-em-ups, shoot-em-ups, fighting games and sports games).
Shoot-em-ups are a tossup depending on what it throws at you. Stuff like Gradius works with a keyboard, but heaven help you if you tried this with one. Shit just goes too fast and with odd angles.
Controllers are better for most games that aren't roguelikes or similar.
Or I guess technically FPSes, but even still I actually prefer using a controller just because I'm not very good at aiming with a mouse.
And rhythm games are usually better on either a keyboard or specially-designed peripheral (usually the latter because of the whole "you can't hold down arbitrary key combinations" thing on keyboards).
I suppose the rule of thumb is that both complexity and precision work better on a keyboard and mouse, whereas "twitch" games or those that require less precision are better suited to a controller.
Also, hey Crimson.
I prefer a keyboard for platformers, too, though that wasn't always the case, it took me a while to get used to it.
^^I saw that on RPS, I was going to post it too, but I figured I was the only one who cared.