Those who defend the--fuck it, I'm talking about White Knighting

RedEyedAbyss

I say that if it's a persistent problem, a few suspensions are in order.

Crimson

>Implying that the TvTropes mods actually crack down on anything when need be.

Schitzo

-reads up-

OH FUCK WHAT EW GOD WHAT THE HELL MAN

ninjaclown

Can't say I'm surprised, to be honest.

All Nines

What ninjaclown said. That's too bad, though; she's pretty cool, from the little that I've talked to her.

Crimson

>Can't say I'm surprised, to be honest.

Same here, this happens all the time with girls that perceived to be even remotely attractive.

Icalasari

Schitzo: How far up? I went 2-3 pages back myself and thought I got to what AHR was talking about, but I may be wrong

Schitzo

Actually, I don't know either. Try 5 pages back

Waltzy

Oh jeez.

That was so uncomfortable to read. x___x

Legionnaire

What.

MillerCross

We all know TvT won't ban anyone for sexual harassment (Remember Lameo and Malkavian?)

Only time I remember it sort of happening was the AFGNCAAP and Made of Meat deal, but I digress.

To keep this on topic: Yeah, white knighting falls into that line of behaviour that really annoys me that protoypical nice guys engage in all the time (The whole "I'll protect you so we can get laid over the interwebz" thing) and it's frankly grating and annoying that there are so many set ups for it because of how people can't just treat women like people in the internet.

InsanityAddict

If it's any consolation, that type of person will probably also display the same niceguy behaviour in meatspace if given a non-threatening enough situation.

 

AHR

Well, to be fair, it's sometimes hard to know what's actual harassment, and what's one person trying to be nice/joking/etc. etc. I'm not saying that it makes it ok, but if everyone got a chance to ban someone because they thought they were being harassed by them...

I don't think many people here would be left.

I know I've felt harassed several times, but enough people told me I was completely wrong about that, that it would have been completely unfair to make any bannings over it.

RedEyedAbyss

But if it keeps happening,  then it's a telltale sign. And if you're going to give everyone the banhammer to swing around for every petty vendetta, well, that's the reason why not everyone has ban powers.

AHR

And how much is "keeps happening"?

Everytime they see you?

They start pming you without you wanting them to? (This is what the mods are using, as evidenced by the meaty incident, and the more recent tendo incident).

Everytime you act a specific way?

How they act to everyone in general, but it bothers you everytime?

What?

RedEyedAbyss

"Regarding the last few pages...What. The. Fuck.

I'm already insecure around these parts, and I get incredibly uncomfortable when the conversation turns to me. Seeing that derail about me was upsetting, honestly. It wasn't even necessary. None of the conversations that happen about me are necessary.

But, I have to thank Juan for allowing me the chance to say something about this, because I've been wanting to for quite some time.

I'm just someone who posts on the fora. Nothing more."

This is obviously a statement coming from someone who's been sexually harassed one too many times. The key thing is that she feels like she's being objectified.

I'm no longer active on the forums, so I can't really figure out whodunit, but I do think the forum should send the message that sexual harassment is unacceptable. There's quite the misogynist culture breeding there due to the lack of action, and that worries me.

AHR

Oh, I understand, I just don't think it's right to blame the mods on not doing anything. It's hard to crack down on, because of what can be misinterpreted as harassment and whatnot.

It's easier to figure out when someone is saying "fuck you" in a non-joking way, that's for sure at least.

RedEyedAbyss

At the very least, warnings backed with a genuine (temp) ban threat should deter people. Of course, actually expecting the mods to follow through on bans is a little too much to ask from that forum, and even then, Fast Eddie has that utterly moronic notion of not indicating who was banned,

AHR

But they do follow through on bans. Some slip through the cracks, yes, but it's a big forum, and the forum is not the focus of the site. I mean, the edit banned thread usually gets updated every other day or so, with new people who have been banned. 

Long term, the people who deserve to be banned and are banned greatly outnumber the ones who get away.

All Nines

Either way, it's part of the mods' job to tell people they shouldn't be sexually harassing other people, and if anything of the sort is reported to them, they should damn well do something about it. And it reflects poorly on TVTropes that they should even need to put up a "don't sexually harass people" disclaimer.

MillerCross

From my own experience, it takes a long time to get banned unless you fuck with the wiki or eddie himself.

At any rate, it shouldn't be a matter of whether other people intend to objectify and hrass you (after all, everyone's the good guy of their own story.) But if you yourself feel harassed.

If you do, then you should call moderation, and let them follow with the proper punishment, if needed.

The fact that Morven had come in and said before to lay off and people didn't speaks volumes of the current state of affairs.

glennmagusharvey

@AHR: Also, that thread is for editing bans, not forum bans.

AHR

Forum bans are also appealed there. As evidenced by many people from the forum making appeals there.

Whooh, redundancy.

MillerCross

Yes, but it doesn't always happen. And if it does, it's when then baan is particularly controversial.

AHR

Jasonwill 2's ban was controversial?

MillerCross

I think that was more of an exception. I don't think deuxhero's, signed's et al bans were discussed in the edit banned thread.

AHR

And? That doesn't change the fact that the edit banned thread is evidence of the mods doing their job plenty of times, and that's only consisting of the people who appeal, both in forum and in wiki.

MillerCross

Fairly sure GMH's point was not whether moderation does their job or not (i happen to disagree, but at this stage, i'm tired of the discussion on whether tvt's administration is good or bad)

my point is simply that bans are not nnounced, and if you want to know who is or isn't banned, then you have to ask. And this seems a bit clunky.

AHR

I am talking about my reply to Abyss Worm.

captainbrass

Oh, embarrassingly inept flirting builds into something really uncomfortable. I knew there was a reason I never read threads including the words "troper" and "crushes."

On topic, I think white knighting online should never be necessary because mods should be able to deal with situations like that. In real life, it might be justified in some circumstances. I mean, what are you supposed to do if you see a woman being attacked, walk away because she might object to you thinking she can't look after herself? Obviously, it would be very sleazy to do that and then expect something in return.

It would also greatly improve TV Tropes if they could be bothered to announce forum bans in a formal way. They won't because, despite making "don't be a dick" his main rule, Eddie seems weirdly afraid of actually announcing that "Well, we've concluded X is in fact being a dick."