How all-female casts are pratically UBIQUITIOUS in anime/manga/japanese video games

Malkavian · 2011-10-24 18:03:25

Bitch, I saw her first.

Forzare · 2011-10-24 18:06:00

^ Pffft, you just don't understand our love.

glennmagusharvey · 2011-10-24 18:10:32

Wait, all-female casts are crafted based on harem stereotypes?

...I pretty much have had no exposure to harem animé, but...somehow I doubt this.

Noimporta · 2011-10-24 18:32:41

For one thing, the yaoi fangirls do not make up the entire fanbase, it's more of a vocal minority.

And for another, a lot of the jokes are in fact historical, and have nothing to do with "look, hot man!"

Yaoi apologist detected.

There's tons of series with a mostly/largely male cast that pander to the female fans. Hetalia is an obvious example ("It's not only about that" doesn't really hold up, few shows are "only about" the fanservice), Black Butler, The Prince Of Tennis, Saiyuki, Sengoku Basara... hell, Ouran couldn't make fun of this sort of stuff if it wasn't prolific. There's obviously more targeted at males, because they're probably the bulk of the anime customer base, and they're both pretty objectifying and bad, though.

AHR · 2011-10-24 18:34:56

Noimporta: Considering how APH was shown at my animé club, and people of various opinions and tastes enjoyed it, I really doubt it's all about the yaoi for many. Those that didn't weren't exactly complaining because of the yaoi either...

MillerCross · 2011-10-24 18:36:17

I really doubt it's all about the yaoi for many.

Noimporta's point is not that it is all about the yaoi. It's that the anime does have such an objectifying subtext and that's enough to draw in said yaoi fans.

AHR · 2011-10-24 18:37:05

That doesn't mean it panders to the female fanbase. It might have elements which yaoi fans like, but that hardly makes it pandering.

Noimporta · 2011-10-24 18:37:17

AHR: Well, yes, but the same could be said about Lucky Star/K-On/Half the shows brought up in the thread. Just because it's not 100% pandering, it doesn't mean the pandering doesn't exist.

Chagen · 2011-10-24 18:38:01

When the fuck did "homo subtext" equal "objectification"?

AHR · 2011-10-24 18:41:47

Noimporta: The difference is the MAIN demographics. Both APH and Lucky Star have the main demographic of males. From there, you have to analyze how all inclusive it is, etc. etc.

From there, you decide if it's pandering or not.

All Nines · 2011-10-24 18:49:00

I feel like I'm the only person here who doesn't mind being pandered to every now and then.

Forzare · 2011-10-24 18:51:37

^ I don't really mind most of the time.

Tachikaze · 2011-10-24 18:54:27

I don't either.

AHR · 2011-10-24 18:54:55

I think "every now and then" is the key term there.

Chagen · 2011-10-24 18:57:15

I don't mind minor pandering.

It's when the work places more emphasis on pleasing my dick than pleasing my brain that I get annoyed.

Also, these girls quite often aren't that hot anyway. You know who one of the hottest female characters in a Japanese work I've read is?

Holo from Spice and Wolf. And there's barely any fanservice in there for the sake of fanservice. And also because Holo is actually an interesting character and not a cookie cutter cutie.

MillerCross · 2011-10-24 18:57:25

I feel like I'm the only person here who doesn't mind being pandered to every now and then.

IJBM: People can't accept they like animu that panders to their sexual or aesthetical tastes.

AHR · 2011-10-24 18:58:03

I'd accept it just fine if there WAS animu that pandered to my sexual tastes

--grumbles--

Chagen · 2011-10-24 18:59:13

But there isn't any animu that panders to my sexual tastes.

Apparently they're too wierd even for Japan.

Tachikaze · 2011-10-24 18:59:51

^^^^ I'm sorry...were we watching the same -insert pretty much any of the shows you listed further up the page-?

Malkavian · 2011-10-24 18:59:54

^^^^Inorite.

^^^^^There's an OP and a scene of Holo stripping after the rain that prove you wrong.

Glenn: Well, I mean of course they do! Sora No Woto has the war vet girl who is friendly to her squad mates and put a sunny disposition on to hide the fact that she has PTSD. Isn't that in every harem anime?

AHR · 2011-10-24 19:02:55

Uh...guys?

You realize I said harem archetypes right?

As in, girls that appeal to a wide variety of guys. Not necessarily an actual harem.

Kinda like how Ouran parodies the male harem archetypes.

Perhaps harem was the wrong word, but basically, characters that are meant to cater to individual tastes, in order to be attractive.

Kinda like with the Token Loli trope.

All Nines · 2011-10-24 19:03:24

"Also, these girls quite often aren't that hot anyway. You know who one of the hottest female characters in a Japanese work I've read is?

Holo from Spice and Wolf. And there's barely any fanservice in there for the sake of fanservice. And also because Holo is actually an interesting character and not a cookie cutter cutie."

Which form are you viewing it in? There are plenty of unnecessary nude shots of Holo in the manga after the first two chapters, at least. Don't know about the anime.

And while she may have more character, she definitely bugs me more than most female characters who're supposed to be attractive. Mostly for the way she talks, granted.

Malkavian · 2011-10-24 19:11:03

"As in, girls that appeal to a wide variety of guys."

This is just vague enough to be a completely worthless statement.

AHR · 2011-10-24 19:12:31

I clarified, if you had continued to read.

Basically, you have characters like a token loli, the meganekko, the shrinking violet, etc. etc. all for the sake of being attractive to the male viewer, instead of actually being a character.

Some shows do it, some do not. This is not a clear cut thing.

Malkavian · 2011-10-24 19:14:11

Your clarification was just as vague and worthless.

AHR · 2011-10-24 19:15:35

How is it worthless, pray tell?

Malkavian · 2011-10-24 19:17:03

Because there isn't a character that isn't made to cater to specific tastes, sexual or otherwise.

You make a character snarky because you think viewers will like snark, you make a character hot because you think viewers will like hot people.

People just pretend it isn't being done to them when it's something they like.

AHR · 2011-10-24 19:20:17

That is not entirely accurate.

Character creating process is not that simple.

Many times, characters are created in a way that would benefit or work in the plot.

Other times it's a natural process on a subconscious level.

The problem is that a lot of times, this is done badly, which usually entails that they put in a lot of girls who have the sole trait of appealing to a male, based on some sort of physical, mental or emotional trait.

And it isn't always elaborated on either. Usually they remain the stereotypes.

Like I just said previously, there is a difference between trying to write a varied cast, and specifically writing stereotypes to cater to males.

Or females. Shojo is not exempt from this.

Chagen · 2011-10-24 19:20:42

"You make a character snarky because you think viewers will like snark, you make a character hot because you think viewers will like hot people."

Actually, I make all of my characters/stories to fit what I like.

I once stated that my works are really more hedonistic expressions of shit I like. Which kinda fits. I make what I like. I don't know why other people don't usually.

Malkavian · 2011-10-24 19:22:12

^That's still catering to tastes, just those that share your own.

^^You're arguing execution now. Characters at their base level need to be appealing in some way, unless you're writing a character whose point is to be hated which is just really reverse catering.

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How all-female casts are pratically UBIQUITIOUS in anime/manga/japanese video games

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