The idea that Skyrim and Skyward Sword are 'dueling games'

Nova

And I really don't feel like giving you a list by list run down of how the gods and creatures are presented, especially since it's been I think half-a-decade since I've played it.

Then I shall endeavour to find this out myself.

I shall have to use the God of War wiki, though.

The Titans were tortured brutally over and over again as a permanent reminder of what they had done, despite Cronos being the only Titan who had done anything wrong in the first place.

Right, no, I give up. Whatever.

Malkavian

Honestly the idea that greek mythology is some tapestry with a unified mood rather than an afghan with a bunch of different storytellers at odds isn't just incorrect, it's disrespectful to how these myths are formed.

Nova

Not particularly, actually. I agree that there are many interpretations, but they do have a single unified purpose; and furthermore, it is not disrespectful at all, and attempting to call it so is kind of laughable. Greek mythology was not formed as a single cohesive whole, but the various pieces of it were informed by each other.

Let us take a look at one aspect of Greek Mythology that the game holds as important to its' very plot; Pandora.

In the game, Pandora's Box is made out of a very lethal material, the Flames of Olympus, that kills anyone who touches it. The only person who can open it is, well, Pandora. Eventually, Kratos gets it open and uses its' powers to kill Ares, but in the process unleashes the Evils upon the world, blah blah blah, he had Hope inside himself but could not use it until he killed himself, you should know how it goes.

However, in the myth Hesiod gives us, this is not how the myth goes, at all. According to his retelling of it, Zeus had Pandora and her pithos created in order to punish mankind for accepting Prometheus' gift of flames- a way to even the scales, I guess. Pandora is created, not as a good type of person, but:

As before, she is created by Hephaestus, but now more gods contribute to her completion (63–82): Athena taught her needlework and weaving (63–4); Aphrodite "shed grace upon her head and cruel longing and cares that weary the limbs" (65–6); Hermes gave her "a shameful mind and deceitful nature" (67–8); Hermes also gave her the power of speech, putting in her "lies and crafty words" (77–80) ; Athena then clothed her (72); next she, Persuasion and the Charites adorned her with necklaces and other finery (72–4); the Horae adorned her with a garland crown (75). Finally, Hermes gives this woman a name: Pandora – "All-gifted" – "because all the Olympians gave her a gift" (81). In this retelling of her story, Pandora's deceitful feminine nature becomes the least of mankind's worries. For she brings with her a jar (which, due to textual corruption in the sixteenth century, came to be called a box) containing "burdensome toil and sickness that brings death to men" (91–2), diseases (102) and "a myriad other pains" (100).

There are those who dispute this, though. The original myth is clouded, as we have very few sources we can draw from. All we can do in this case, though, is let what we know inform us about Greek mythology; for we cannot actually know what Greek mythology was like. We do not have the actual mythology to work from, only our understanding of it.

For example, many people wonder about Hope's inclusion in the box. Is Hope there to inspire mankind after the Evils have been released? Or is Hope trapped in the box in order to make it seem more dreary, as a further punishment?

However, as you can pretty plainly see, the game itself used only the most superficial aspects of this myth, even within the context of the first game. There is a box with all the evils and hopes inside it, created by the Gods (but not near as many as Hesiod claims), blah blah blah. It uses the commonly understood aspects of Greek mythology, but it does not attempt to actually use Greek mythology itself; just the aspects of it that people know, the superficial aspects everyone uses.

MillerCross

Mmmkay, talk about wankery.

Anyway, Skyrim and Skyward Sword were not just "released at the same time". They were highly demanded sequels of two of the most beloved RPing franchises (How much is Zelda of an RP is a debate of its own) in the market that've been around for a long time. Of course, the fact that they weren't on the same console might mean that they appealed to different markets, but that implies there aren't any people out there without two consoles who might just get the two if they're so inclined.

Nova

Mmmkay, talk about wankery.

Well, Christ forgive me, I forgot! I'm not supposed to talk in detail about anything that actually interests me when it's actually relevant, I'm supposed to just make dismissive remarks and only go off-topic when it's a topic others like.

Please, accept my most sincere apology.

...

Needs more pomp. But my point should be made.

MillerCross

When every thread becomes an incomprehensible mess of words with rather simple ideas in it at three AM, then I'd argue that yes, there's a bit of a problem.

Also, I find it utterly hilarious that you criticize others for making dismissive remarks while making one of your own. At least be a little bit more self aware. It's unbecoming.

Nova

When every thread becomes an incomprehensible mess of words with rather simple ideas in it at three AM, then I'd argue that yes, there's a bit of a problem.

Perfectly comprehensible to me. And it's only 1AM.

Also, I find it utterly hilarious that you criticize others for making dismissive remarks while making one of your own. At least be a little bit more self aware. It's unbecoming.

So apparently, thatsthejoke.jpg is a real image.

Anyway, yes, I was attempting to make a joke while still making a point about your constant dismissive attitude towards things you don't like. Unfortunately, as before, 1AM.

DYRE

 (How much is Zelda of an RP is a debate of its own)

Not at all. It's an action-adventure game with puzzles.  The only thing that even makes anyone think that it's an RPG is that Ocarina of Time had lots of cinematic cutscenes, at a time when it was relatively less likely to have such things in games that aren't RPGs, and that reasoning completely fails when it comes to later or earlier Zelda games.

MillerCross

Perfectly comprehensible to me. And it's only 1AM.

All I see is word cruft and bizarre metaphors about candies when talking about mythology. And even then, most of it is rather redundant and rambling at times. Laconism and conciseness are not sins, yannow

Anyway, yes, I was attempting to make a joke while still making a point about your constant dismissive attitude towards things you don't like. Unfortunately, as before, 1AM.

Word of advice: Don't criticize an attitude that you yourself have demonstrated through this thread. Or through your whole posting history tonight.

MadassAlex

Guys.

MillerCross

>Posting that 50 mins after the argument happened

slowpoke.jpg

Icalasari

What the fuck did I miss last night?

glennmagusharvey

(How much is Zelda of an RP is a debate of its own)

Not at all. It's an action-adventure game with puzzles.

Yeah, it's basically a top-down metroidvania.

MrW

Except for the 3D games, which are TPMs(Third-person Metroidvanias).

Skyward Sword is probably the closest the series has gotten to a Metroidvania, however.

DYRE

>implying the 2D games aren't also third person, or, for that matter, implying that Metroid isn't third person

glennmagusharvey

Damn, that is one bitch of a question, Glenn. Scholars could write duelling essays on that for years on end and never reach a conclusion.

I now have the mental image of two pieces of looseleaf paper holding swords going at each other.

Nova

Wrong thread, glenn