Gender

glennmagusharvey

I hate it because I much prefer fighting alongside girls than fighting against them.

IanExMachina

Fighting ?

captainbrass

Glenn - The point about classical music is partly true, but some of it is actually stereotypically male e.g. Beethoven's symphonies, in which a REAL MAN musically engages with BIG IMPORTANT THEMES like LOVE and SPIRITUAL ANGUISH and HIS BIG MANLY ANGST! Likewise, Wagner - in fact a lot of the 19th century Romantics are a bit like that.

That's not to say that a woman couldn't have written such music or wouldn't enjoy it, just that its qualities fit a traditional male stereotype.

glennmagusharvey

I don't think you actually can hear much significant difference between male and female composers, at least from my experience.  Both genders experience a pretty wide range of human emotion, and while publicly-displayed behavior may vary somewhat between genders, privately-felt emotions expressed in music might exhibit less difference, I think.

MillerCross

Brass' point is simply that classical music is as stereotypically manly as death metal is.

IanExMachina

^^

I dunno I think if you compiled the common differences between male and female classical composers you'd have a pretty big Liszt.

I'll get my coat.

glennmagusharvey

Okay, perhaps the stereotype of classical music in my head is more Bach (very intricate structural beauty), Mozart (generally pleasant music), Chopin (legendary lyricism), Prokofiev (a dry and tight wit), and Messiaen (religious mysticism) than Beethoven (sturm und drang) and Wagner (epic mythology tales told through music).

Blame me for being a pianist.

LouieW

glennmagusharvey,
Have I mentioned how much I hate "guys versus girls" arrangements in party games?

Yeah, those are not very fun at all, are they? I am not sure I really understand the point of a having a rivalry between men and women anyway.

As long as we are talking about annoying gender distinctions and the awkward situations they create, I guess I have a few more to add if I may:

• Being the only man/woman/dog in a group and being asked your opinion as a man/woman/dog as if you can represent that huge and diverse of a population on your own.
• Being given special attention or treatment merely because you are a man/woman/dog. 
• Doing something and having someone else say something like "that is so like a woman/man" to do that.
• People making suggestions as if your main concern in interacting with someone of the opposite sex is the possibility of being in a romantic relationship with him or her.

glennmagusharvey

> People making suggestions as if your main concern in interacting with
someone of the opposite sex is the possibility of being in a romantic
relationship with him or her.

Oh, this.

It actually is a bit more complicated especially since I believe that lasting romance ought to be based in compatibility, which is also the basis of friendship.

That said, while it's true that I and various friends of mine of the opposite sex are physically capable of engaging in sexual intercourse, doesn't mean that we're actually looking for that to do with each other.

MadassAlex

"guys versus girls" arrangements in party games

---

I personally just find these fun, if only for the mudslinging.

InsanityAddict

*damn, that sounded too much like /adv/. terminated*

LouieW

glennmagusharvey,
It actually is a bit more complicated especially since I believe that lasting romance ought to be based in compatibility, which is also the basis of friendship.

That said, while it's true that I and various friends of mine of the opposite sex are physically capable of engaging in sexual intercourse, doesn't mean that we're actually looking for that to do with each other.

I agree with you on that first point and I think the second one is kind of a problem about perceptions of friendships that is becoming more prevalent these days. I believe that looking at opposite sex friendships as if most if not all of the time they are leaning towards romantic relationships ultimately cheapens friendships  as if they are only a means to the "better" romantic relationship and can never really be a true end in themselves.

When you add people seeing homosexual subtext in most every strong friendship in fiction (or real life) between two or more men and two or more women and the reaction to that subtext (the dumb "no homo" stuff), then I feel like the idea of friendship itself can become a lot less meaningful if not completely empty. That is not a comment on sexual orientation and such, I just dislike what I see as the devaluing of  friendships today.

Scythemantis

I refer to transgendered individuals by their preference, but people who hate the whole concept of gender entirely and want to be referred to as made-up stuff like "zee" instead of he/she is just too awkward for me, I can't take it seriously. I get a massive sensation of narm from it.

Anonus

I don't really understand that sort of thing. I began understanding transgenderism gradually (and came to understand part of why the "T" in "LGBT" is there), but I still can't grasp genderless-ness/"third gender" sort of things.

RedEyedAbyss

In regards to genderlessness, think about whether you would participate in "gendered" behaviour if you were not told it was "correct" or "not correct". That's the way I tend to think about it, though I might not be the most reliable source.

Anonus

Inside I probably wouldn't care what was "correct" and "incorrect" behavior for a male, but I'd probably try at least for a little bit to conform to it.

RedEyedAbyss

From personal experience, I didn't know that the concept of a "gender" existed for the longest time. I thought "masculinity" and "femininity" were merely artificial constructs that people leaned towards. In my case, I found myself disliking and rejecting many aspects of masculinity. In any case, there's still nurture and societal influence to affect my unconscious, so I'm not sure if I really qualify as agendered or if it's something I simply haven't given much thought to.

Anonus

I used to want to be more masculine, but thought it wasn't worth it so I dropped this desire.