"Patriarchy"

CommandoDude

It's the straight up most stupidest shit I hear out of feminists. Every single time one of them utters that word I lose that much more sympathy for feminism as a whole.

I hate to see people clinging onto sexism that stopped happening by the end of the 90s as a way to justify their self depreciation.

Is there really a glass cieling? Or are you just using that as an excuse to not try? Are you really being paid less for the same work? Or are you being paid less because you don't actually work as hard?

Trash_Vortex

fuck you

DYRE

In both cases, the former.

CommandoDude

The questions were rhetorical.

GLORIOUSLeader

Or are you being paid less because you don't actually work as hard?

Unintentional sexism lol.

CommandoDude

It's not sexist. It's true. Men statistically work more overtime then women. And in more physically demanding jobs. With much higher fatality risks.

Facts are darned things.

GLORIOUSLeader

Bad phrasing on your part, then, because it sounded like "Women get payed less because they're lazier then men."

Myrmidon

I am so pissed off that AHR doesn't post on these forums right now.

Trash_Vortex

^^^ You haven't actually cited anything.

CommandoDude

This is IJBM. Not OTC.

I have cited shit enough as it is over there and on ED in Gaia Online way back when.

glennmagusharvey

^^^ You should get AHR to come post here then.

Also, CD:
> implying that physically-demanding work is necessarily harder than mentally-demanding work

Gelzo

I don't think physically demanding work really equates to high-paying work. There's a reason I'm not skipping my classes to work out at the gym.

BonSequitur

Yes, those damn womenfolk claiming society is somehow male-dominated! They should get back in the kitchen traditional gender roles.

TuefelHundenIV

Glenn: Your not very likely incure injury or death from mentally tasking job.  It will be quite the day where thinking to hard blows out your back or cripples you.

Yes they are more demanding as the risk/likely hood of actual physical permanent injury makes a task that much harder as you have to take extra steps to minimize injury or chances of injury.

I don't think anyone is going to try and prevent you from getting a "brain sprain" or impalement by math to your mental state.

Granted it is possible to drive yourself insane if your too mentally taxed.

CommandoDude

No. But blue collar jobs with an emphasis on hard labor pay better then blue collar jobs with an emphasis on customer service.

You're not suppose to compare manual labor work to a desk job.

^^ I smell straw.

GLORIOUSLeader

Because, you know, women never take hard labor jobs and men never take desk jobs.

glennmagusharvey

My mom mows the lawn.

CommandoDude

^^ Anyone can do a desk job. But how many women do you see in a coal mine or a steel mill? Exceptions don't prove the point.

^ MOWS THE LAWN! Oh dear me! That really is just hard labor! Spending a whole...what? Half hour to get the job done, then only finally after that, can she go back into the comfort of her home.

Gelzo

glennmagusharvey

More like 45 minutes at least, and longer if she bags the grass.

And then immediately after that, if it happens to be the late afternoon, she then stands in the kitchen and makes dinner, entree and soup and all.

And for that matter, if you don't think cooking in a kitchen is physically demanding work, you haven't lifted one of these pans or pots and filled or emptied them, and had to do this at high speeds in order to watch the timing of five other things at once.

Also, you're missing the whole point of the patriarchy criticism.

Forzare

TuefelHundenIV

Kitchen work is physically demanding.  Between heat and heft of the cooking gear and hauling around things.  Cooking is seldom lazy.

CommandoDude

There's a difference between "Physically demanding work" and "Manual labor"

So, I can't really sympathize. Cooking is nothing like working in a factory. And I'd imagine any factory worker would be heavily insulted if you implied that.

Especially, since my mom has been the subject of REAL workplace pay discrimination, back in the 90s. Where it wasn't "Oh! Men get 33 cents more to the dollar!" without any real empirical evidence.

glennmagusharvey

> "Oh! Men get 33 cents more to the dollar!" without any real empirical evidence.

...I see what you want.

You want your personal experiences and others' anecdotes to line up to statistics.

TuefelHundenIV

Commando; Large scale kitchens feeding hundreds to thousands is very much like a facotry complete with dangerous machinery.  I have worked in such kitchens.  They use a lot of "industrial grade equipment"  Like mixers big enough shove a person into.

Massive blending/chopping machines.  It is a giant food factory.  Military Chow hall duty I will never forget you.

CommandoDude

^ Glenn was talking about his mom cooking for a family dude.

^^ The 'statistic' in question, is laughable, because it's been debunked. But feminists still continue to cite the study that claims men earn 33 (I forget the exact number tbh) cents more then women per hour worked.

So no.

I included a personal anecdote because I've SEEN discrimination. And it's a lot more "I was clearly a victim of sexism" then "Men must earn more then me because that's what I've been told."

TuefelHundenIV

Ahh for a family.  Yeah still hard work but not as nasty as factory stuff.

ninjaclown

I really don't think this is a really big deal.

Sammy

"I included a personal anecdote because I've SEEN discrimination."

And what did it look like? What did it feel like? On what grounds was your example of discrimination more real or more harmful than other people's?

What are your thoughts on white privilege, by the way? Cultural (non-legislative) homophobia? 

Whoops, forgot one: define patriarchy.

ninjaclown

Yeah, this isn't the worst discrimination of I've ever heard of.

Rottweiler

Whenever feminists blame "the patriarchy", I like to pretend they mean this guy.