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Anyone wanna find their own hosting for it?
You might be able to find logs of all the stuff that's been cut. Pretty easy to just convert that to whatever other format and then repost it on another wiki.
Call it the NSFWiki? lol.
Edit: No, I'm NOT spearheading this project.
Post edited by glennmagusharvey at 2012-04-20 10:49:48 -
>NSFW
>spearheading -
The articles are going to be reinstated, yannow.
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^ This IS Eddie we're talking about. We can't know for certain what he has planned
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It would be nice to have a new wiki. No more Kodomo No Jiken? I shudder at the thought. I really loved that anime, and only found it through TV Tropes. At least they didn't cut Mitsdumoe...or just hadn't found it yet...
Plus, me and my friends put up an article for a series of roleplaying forum games that mentions lolicon a lot. After all that work we put into the page, it would feel like a slap in the face to have it all deleted in the blink of an eye.
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^ This IS Eddie we're talking about. We can't know for certain what he has planned
Except we do and the mods have become far more trustable. (Mostly because most of the old ones are not as prominent)
Look, I don't like TvT and I still think this was the dumbest plan in the history of plans, but I still think iit's ridiculous that people are talking about this as if the plan was just to delete the articles.
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For what it's worth, Custer's Revenge was found and purged sometime today or yesterday. Beat Angel Escalayer was found and purged a few days back. (I started both pages so I have more of an inkling of caring about them than other random porn works.)
They haven't found a certain page yet. For its security, I'm not going to say what it is directly, just that I was once involved in its source...by accident.
Also, history may still be visible. Literally. Grab it while it's still hot.
@Everest: fuck you screw you the heck with you
Post edited by glennmagusharvey at 2012-04-20 12:52:58 -
Man, this is just getting dumber and dumber.
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I aim to provide tools for the preservation of useful information. I cannot provide that preservation itself, but I can help.
...oh my, looking back through said source, I'm remembering when the sockpuppet Yamada was attempting to have sex with everyone. That was pretty fuckin' weird.
Post edited by glennmagusharvey at 2012-04-20 12:54:36 -
>mfw that Yamada sockpuppet was me
Man, those were weird times for me. Glad I'm over it. >.>;
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Isn't the Fetish Fuel wiki going to be a dumping ground for that stuff anyway?
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^ That's a pretty good point
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I think we can all blame this on TVT becoming more popular, and thus creating a need to appear more "clean" to avoid attracting negative attention from the mainstream.
While some good has no doubt come out of this (much of the wiki was a giant mess in the past), sometimes the Admins take it a little bit too far. -
a need to appear more "clean" to avoid attracting negative attention from the mainstream.
I was under the impression that it was more to avoid attracting negative attention from the adservice that keeps it going.
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The ire concerning this isn't so much that pages have been removed, but that the removal has been so extreme and undemocratic. Fast Eddie has a habit of implying that he can do whatever he wants with his wiki, but fails to recognise that it's a collaborative effort and people have put personal work (of however much or little quality) into those pages.
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^ Yes. If you wanna keep people coming and contributing, you gotta preserve the sense that their contributions are actually valuable and valued.
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I was under the impression that it was more to avoid attracting negative attention from the adservice that keeps it going.
Thats how it started, then Eddie found stuff like KnJ and that manga about the 10 year old succubus and wanted rid of it
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I thought this was actually because someone did another Google-tattle about a page that didn't even have Google ads this time?
Post edited by glennmagusharvey at 2012-04-20 13:34:23 -
I agree Eddie is acting a little dictatorial. Once Google is satisfied, the censorship should stop there.
Post edited by TheDarkEricDraven at 2012-04-20 13:42:25 -
I thought this was actually because someone did another Google-tattle about a page that didn't even have Google ads this time?
Are you talking about the Naughty tentacles page?
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That's what I heard.
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Eddie said that he wanted to go further than just the bare minimum
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They haven't found a certain page yet. For its security, I'm not going to say what it is directly, just that I was once involved in its source...by accident.
-has the first 6500+ pages of the second forum thread saved-
-not sure why-
Post edited by DYRE at 2012-04-20 14:21:47 -
I agree Eddie is acting a little dictatorial. Once Google is satisfied, the censorship should stop there.
I wonder if you can steal a web domain?
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Eddie found stuff like KnJ and that manga about the 10 year old succubus
What really gets me is that more or less everyone on TV Tropes, on this site, on SA and half the rest of the Internet had all heard of KnJ before Eddie tumbled to the idea that it might be a bit controversial.
Eddie is acting a little dictatorialHe was always prone to that, but the real problem is that he's never dictatorial enough at the right moments. If he'd deleted some of this stuff months ago he'd had saved himself a lot of trouble. Instead, he's been cracking down on a lot of the people who were trying to tell him there was a problem.
Post edited by captainbrass at 2012-04-20 14:36:46 -
lrdgck
2012-04-20 14:40:51
of a country that is all bog-land, they say, and full of horrible Jews, to say nothing of the Cossacks and the peasantsAnd that last thing kind of smells to me too.
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TV Tropes never should have tried cleaning up. I didn't even know Panty Shot was cleared of examples until this stuff started. Stupid Google.
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You should start up a NSFW tropes wiki or help contribute the old TVT content to it, then.
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Edit: No, I'm NOT spearheading this project.
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TV Tropes definitely had to clean up, but ideally it should have been a change powered by the community and supported by the staff. The thing is, previous efforts to do just that have been blocked by overly defensive contributors. This whole mess could have been avoided if those initial efforts had been supported by the staff rather than getting their catalyst members banned by Fast Eddie.
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Like Lola?
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^ Among others. Annebeeche and USAF 713/Flyboy/Lightning Knight also came into that category, I think.
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@CentralAvenue: In my defence, I didn't create IJBM 2.0.
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no, but you admin'd it from the very beginning, no?
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I wasn't planning to, but @Longfellow made me an admin.
That said, I haven't taken any leadership role in any of the other spinoffs, such as Troper Tales Wiki, Fetish Fuel Wiki, Beyond the Lampshade, or Heapers' Hangout.
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Liar.
We all know you're Anonus, Annebeeche, Manga Maniac and [whoever founded ffwiki]
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I'm hoping they get reinstated -- if nothing else, that would prove I was right and we can actually talk about adult tropes without turning into laughing stocks. Hopefully that would be enough to get this darn ban removed. :/
And the "10 year old succubus" manga is clean, darnit. At the very least, it's nowhere near as risque as Kodomo No Jikan (which I can't even stomach a little of, yet enough to make an opinion on if it's worth all the squick or not).
I do wish he'd consider the "exh plan," as it would be the best of both worlds. Basically, you'd see a second site sharing the same database as TVTropes. Using a modified variant of the YMMV system (where YMMV tropes cause a bullet point to be a different color) you set up "NSFW tropes" to be hidden via CSS -- the standard site just doesn't display them at all. Then you make a second site where that CSS class ID is not set to hidden. Ta-da. NSFW content is completely segregated from the main site proper.
Google can't be trolled by faux outrage since outside of editing there's no evidence that the content is on the site (cause it's literally not on the site, it's on "MediaTropes" or whatnot), the users who wish to see the full unabridged tropes list can just go to the other domain, etc etc.
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And the "10 year old succubus" manga is clean, darnit. At the very least, it's nowhere near as risque as Kodomo No Jikan (which I can't even stomach a little of, yet enough to make an opinion on if it's worth all the squick or not).
Lotte no Omocha still has a fair amount of lolicon fanservice (or at least the anime does. I haven't actually read the manga), even if it is true that it's nowhere near as bad as the premise might suggest. And being less risque than Kodomo No Jikan isn't really saying much, since Kodomo No Jikan seems to go out of its way to be as ecchi as possible without actually being 18+.
Post edited by DYRE at 2012-04-20 18:47:02 -
The anime is way more fanservicey than the manga. Like an entire order of magnitude more. The first episode was absolute tripe, but episodes 2-10 are fine. (The last two are a gecko ending, but weirdly every element made up for the anime has been added to the manga -- including Lotte's wing tattoo appearing, so who knows.)
The most blatantly fanservice laiden thing in the manga is ironically in the latest chapter of this writing, where they have a flashback when the Queen, er, raped the main character when he was younger. There's no real way to sugar coat that, I guess -- although just how screwed up that is is pointed out a few times. It's still not shown, just dialogue and hands intertwining, but still.
I get why people are put off by the premise, but at the same time to call it porn is just retarded.
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Well if you're just talking about its removal from TV Tropes, then it wasn't (entirely) because Eddie or anyone else thinks its actually porn, but because it sexualizes child or child-like characters, which... it does, even if not necessarily to a large extent. I mean, Lolita got taken down too, and nobody thinks Lolita is porn.
If you're talking more generally, then it's likely just people drawing conclusions without reading/watching it based on cursory knowledge, which happens all the time.
Post edited by DYRE at 2012-04-20 19:09:15 -
I suppose you're right. That it was so knee-jerk (and completely lacked in communication) is my real problem with it -- I was even banned for the "unacceptable position" that the purge wasn't really needed.
Part of the problem is that Fast Eddie, by his own admission, doesn't really pay attention to the anime and manga side of things. There's a bit of a culture shock when you go from one side of the site to the anime / manga side, I mean. Combine that with him being harassed by SomethingAwful for ~11 months or so, and the whole thing being stressful as all getout, and I don't envy his position. I feel bad that I added to that, however inadvertently.
I do wish I could edit trope pages again, though. :( I'm going through withdrawals!
Post edited by KiTA at 2012-04-20 19:11:52 -
Maybe we could talk with TVT leadership about setting up some sort of bot or other service that archives stuff on TVT, so that we can preserve the results of the time and effort put in by the site's contributors to topics and works that are now banned from TVT.
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Maybe we could talk with TVT leadership about setting up some sort of bot or other service that archives stuff on TVT, so that we can preserve the results of the time and effort put in by the site's contributors to topics and works that are now banned from TVT.Post edited by Zennistrad at 2012-04-20 20:10:43
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I'm pretty sure Eddie is reading the SomethingAwful thread. I was only banned after they dug up a quote of mine from a conversation Eddie was a part of. He said "it's hard to take that as anything but admission you are a pedophile[I am, but that's now how I meant the sentence to read]."
He offered to let me come back with a different username, but I declined. I know that the other thread here got locked for Eddie bashing, but isn't that a bit hypocritical? He says "well, you're a pedophile, but if you come back with a different username so no one knows you are the same, that's fine".
I think he cares more about what SA thinks of him and the site then the actual people who use it. He never had a problem with loli anime and stuff before. It's not like those pages got there overnight.
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I'm pretty sure Eddie is reading the SomethingAwful thread. I was only banned after they dug up a quote of mine from a conversation Eddie was a part of. He said "it's hard to take that as anything but admission you are a pedophile[I am, but that's now how I meant the sentence to read]."
Uh, you sure you want to be admitting that to everyone here?
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Yyyyeeeeaaaah . . . Are we talking lolicon, or full-on attraction to real children, Draven?
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As long as he doesn't rape kids (Or pretends it's a good thing), I'm ok with a little honesty.
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Likewise. People can control their behaviour and should be held responsible for it, but they can't control their internal inclinations. It's certainly not a good thing, but nor is it something that makes someone inherently bad.
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I wouldn't say it's inherently a bad thing if he is. I just don't see why he felt the need to admit something like that. Even if it's not wrong to have that feeling, it's something that skeeves me out a bit. I'd liken it to if someone described their bowel movements to us: it's probably not a cause for real concern, but I would have preferred not to know, and if anything it's not my place to know.
My analogy's kinda blunt, and if it's too blunt, I apologize, but you know what I mean.Post edited by All Nines at 2012-04-21 00:22:11 -
Short version: "Sometimes being too honest is too much"
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