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"Tower Of Heaven isn't very hard"

edited 2011-05-03 16:45:45 in General
Yes it is, shut the fuck up.

Comments

  • Creature - Florida Dragon Turtle Human
    It's more frustrating than hard, but the main reason it's not very hard is because there are only a few levels and they're all relatively short.
  • edited 2011-05-03 17:58:37
    Loser
    Myrmidon,

    I thought people tended to refuse to say that any game was difficult in order to look cool or good at playing games or something. I may be wrong about that though because I have heard people say that some games were Nintendo Hard before.

    Still, I feel like people online are much more likely to say that something was easy. I think that can get annoying if you are not great games, but I guess that people who like discussing them are much more likely to be good at them too.
  • How is a game easier because it's shorter? Doesn't that just mean it takes the same skill but less time to beat it?
  • They call me Rate Miser, whatever I see... turns overrated in my eyes...
    Because it takes less skill overall to beat all the challenges the game throws at you. There's little difficulty curve in a short game.
  • Creature - Florida Dragon Turtle Human
    Also, if you're really sore, then I'll let you know that the level where you start on the lower left, the exit is on the upper left, and you have to deal with buzzsaws then yellow platforms and then fans above flowers, that level is the last level that's like that, and is probably the hardest level in the game.

    And even that only took me a few minutes to beat.

    @LouieW: I thought that people wanted to claim that games they beat were harder because this makes them more exciting and makes the players seem more skilled.
  • Tower of Heaven is moderately difficult, I'd say.
  • edited 2011-05-04 16:38:07
    Loser
    glennmagusharvey,

    I thought that people wanted to claim that games they beat were harder
    because this makes them more exciting and makes the players seem more
    skilled.


    I think that those people probably would want the games they beat to seem difficult to other people, sure. However, I also believe that they would want it to appear as though they easily beat what everyone else thought was a difficult game (if that makes any sense).

    I may not have the most representative sample for this type of thing, but I rarely have encountered a large group of people online talking about how difficult a game is (and when I have, it seems to me like someone appears on the scene you thought it was easy). I have seen quite a few people describe many games as being incredibly easy or far too easy for them though.  I doubt all of those people are exaggerating how easy the games were for them, but I do think that people tend to not want to seem bad at games even when they do struggle.
  • Creature - Florida Dragon Turtle Human
    That does make sense, yes.

    That said, I do remember childhood experiences of talking to friends about how difficult a boss battle is and how good it feels to beat it.
  • Games that are too difficult aren't fun. Games that are too easy aren't fun. Games that are of medium difficulty can be fun but sometimes aren't.

    The problem is people equate fun with reward. Its why Upgrade Complete was so successful, and why 'upgrading' is a good gameplay model. If it feels like the player is being rewarded for their progress sufficiently, the effort expended becomes justified. A very difficult game gives recompense in the form of bragging rights. A medium difficulty game usually gives recompense in the form of upgrades. A very easy game might provide more story.

    The problem is not the difficulty. Its the reward offered for rising to the level of challenge suggested. Its also why ingame rewards based on beating a game at the hardest difficulty level piss me off, because they're usually very minor rewards, given in exchange for hours if not days of game time.
  • Creature - Florida Dragon Turtle Human
    Well, what do you think a game should reward you with for defeating the super-difficult bonus boss?
  • Something a little more awe inspiring than an extra costume for one character, or a big head mode cheat, frankly. Something big enough to make it seem worth it.
  • Creature - Florida Dragon Turtle Human
    Such as?
  • Creature - Florida Dragon Turtle Human
    My ideas have actually been along these lines:
    * sound test / soundtrack
    * production and development commentary
    * playable beta version
    * game editor
  • Extra endings are a step in the right direction, access to some form or method of altering the game perhaps, like increasing enemy speed and spawn rate, or decreasing it. Noclip modes, a secret dungeon, or a minigame, providing its a good minigame, like the car stage in street fighter or a packed-in geometry wars.

    Lots of possibilities, its not my job to tell the designers how to do that. All I'm saying is difficulty has to be balanced against reward to stop people getting bored, whether that be early or late game.
  • Creature - Florida Dragon Turtle Human
    But the secret dungeon was where we found the bonus boss in the first place!

    Minigames are kinda nice but for what it's worth at least I'm not the kind of gamer who particularly enjoys them.

    However, game-editing is definitely a nice idea.  The main thing this hinges on is that you need someplace to store the edited game, or people won't like losing their work.  This means that the game had better be a computer game or the console had better have hard drive space for storage.

    That said, I know that there are RPG Maker games for SNES.  I wonder how they did storage; I think they just used battery storage somehow.  I don't know how.

    What's a noclip mode?
  • Consoles with hard drives? Good lord GMH, you ask the impossible sometimes.
  • And noclip is turning off collision detection so you can walk through walls.
  • Creature - Florida Dragon Turtle Human
    ^^ I am fully aware that many consoles come with hard drives these days.  I just wanted to make a more comprehensive statement that considered more alternate possibilities.

    ^ Ah, I forgot that; something like that should be included in game editing tools.
  • edited 2011-05-04 17:07:35
    ^^^^ Having to unlock a level editor seems... pretty dumb.  It seems like that's the sort of thing that should be available from the start (though adding more options to it based on completion of the main game would be acceptable, I guess).

    And the SNES RPG Maker games did storage the same way any other SNES game did storage as far as I know which is, poorly.  Thus resulting in having a very, very, limited amount of space to, like, make stuff.  The other console RPG Maker games were a bit better about it but still pretty limited due to the limitations of the Playstation/PS2 memory card.  The recent DS RPG Maker game was, as expected, much more restrictive than the PS2 games as far as total amount of content in a game.  I assume the GBA ones were also pretty bad about it but I have no experience with those.
  • I reiterate.

    Lots of possibilities, its not my job to tell the designers how to do
    that. All I'm saying is difficulty has to be balanced against reward to
    stop people getting bored, whether that be early or late game.
  • Creature - Florida Dragon Turtle Human
    > Having to unlock a level editor seems... pretty dumb.  It seems like
    that's the sort of thing that should be available from the start (though
    adding more options to it based on completion of the main game would be
    acceptable, I guess).

    Well, if you make that an unlockable, then you kinda make sure that the player will experience what your game itself has to offer before taking it apart.
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