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IJBM: being aware of and taking care of loose ends that one produces is not "being anal".

in General
Creature - Florida Dragon Turtle Human
It is "taking responsibility for the consequences of one's actions and presence".

Comments

  • "Taking care of loose ends" and "being anal" can go hand in hand, hurhur. 
  • There is love everywhere, I already know
    you really need to get a new roommate

    unless this is somehow not about him
  • "you duck spawn, refined creature, you try to be cynical, yokel, but all that comes out of it is that you're a dunce!!!!! you duck plug!"
    I'm kinda bugged by the (apparently Freudian?) term "anal" and why it's always "anal", never "oral" or whatever, but not to the point of starting a new thread.
  • At least it's less painful than being anally bugged. 
  • "you duck spawn, refined creature, you try to be cynical, yokel, but all that comes out of it is that you're a dunce!!!!! you duck plug!"
    With you saying that, I hope Glenn's roomie lacks access to chloroform.
  • One hopes the anus is not a loose end.  That can get messy.
  • edited 2015-10-08 19:18:57
    Oh good, I was worried I was the only one who kept feeling like this thread title sounded filthy.
  • edited 2015-10-08 20:07:40
    Creature - Florida Dragon Turtle Human
    you really need to get a new roommate

    unless this is somehow not about him



    LOL

    He actually never directly accused me of being anal, but I was just taking one thing he said one time and extrapolating an argument he might make based on a comparison of how he does various other things versus how I do various other things.

    To be honest, if anything, the initial reaction isn't that important.  It's not that hard to work out some common ground regarding how we do our cooking, and he's likely bringing up more of his own cookware this weekend.  What's more interesting to me is the thought processes that go into the actions that each of us take.

    Like, for example, when he wants to eat something, he'll just go and start making it, and if he runs into issues along the way (such as lacking ingredients), then he just thinks of what to do at that point.  On the other hand, I start making a meal by observing whether I have space on the drying rack to put the dishes after I wash them (and if I don't, I start wiping dishes dry).  As a result he frequently has a pile of utensils in the drying rack.  Of course, I'm not going to help him with this, as long as he doesn't overflow to my side of the rack.

    To be fair, my way of doing things isn't always the best -- he takes more risks and, in the case of relatively low-risk activities, probably gets more done than I do, solely because he just jumps right in without thinking too much about it.  Though sometimes it means making a bigger mess.

    But what I'm thinking of in this thread is mainly his trend of doing stuff and then just dealing with or ignoring the consequences later.  Cooking is probably the most prominent example, but it also applies to his approach toward trash -- such as not flattening boxes and throwing out perfectly reusable things like bags.

    And to be fair, it's not just him.  This is typical of the usual developed-country stereotype of "use and toss" thinking.  But that sort of thinking is precisely what I don't like and feel ought to change about the way we live.

    It's not just about my roommate.  It's about being aware of what things we use, what things we toss, what things we buy, what things we eat, etc., and asking how we can use these things better.

    Like, it's about thinking of using grocery store plastic bags as trash bags rather than just treating them themselves as trash, and it's about not throwing out those extra unused paper napkins but saving them, and it's about using less detergent by squirting it onto the sponge rather than the water in the pot, etc.

    Yeah, one can say that I think like this because I'm cheap, or because of my race, or because I'm an environmentalist, or something.  But really?  Does one need an extra label to justify why I just like saving money and am conscientious about what stuff I use and buy and toss?  Do I really need to justify wanting to not leave any of that delicious scrambled egg on the skillet?  I don't think so, and I think everyone should be more like this.  It's not anal to want to eat all the egg, or all the cheese, or all the whatever, even the scraps.  It's just less wasteful.
  • "you duck spawn, refined creature, you try to be cynical, yokel, but all that comes out of it is that you're a dunce!!!!! you duck plug!"
    I have completely no idea what's wrong with being cheap. Though the race argument (if it means what I think it means) is definitely the explanation I'd prefer to use for myself. Heck, I do think I used it at least once as a native of a city whose natives have a reputation for that, although it has recently been overshadowed by a reputation for something else.
  • Creature - Florida Dragon Turtle Human
    I think the thing with being cheap is basically the willingness to reuse something, or keep using something because it's not totally broken yet, or possibly kludge something together to work -- for example, using the mouse wheel as a button when the wheel starts sticking, or reusing supermarket plastic bags as trash bags, or washing out and reusing disposable but reusable plastic containers from fast food places; as opposed to buying a new mouse, or buying dedicated trash bags, or buying and only using dedicated "tupperware" containers while disposing of the ones that come from the restaurants, respectively.

    Naturally, you'd see more of this "cheap" behavior from immigrant families in the United States, who have less financial resources to waste than well-off whites, hence the stereotype here in the US of it being associated with recent immigrant groups like Asians.
  • "you duck spawn, refined creature, you try to be cynical, yokel, but all that comes out of it is that you're a dunce!!!!! you duck plug!"

    Incidentally: on a scale of 1-10, how bad do you think it is that I thought it could be made into a gender issue? Like, the notion that a man should be able to fix stuff instead of just throwing it out and buying a new one, is yet another societal harm caused by the patriarchal oppression.

    The other quick question could be, on a scale of 1-10, how easy would it be to actually turn it into a gender issue (assume the use of Tumblr as a platform). But I'm not sure if it's good for one's sanity to dwell for too long on that.

    I actually have some thoughts that are (marginally) closer to topic, but I'll save them for later.

  • Creature - Florida Dragon Turtle Human
    You can attempt to associate "making stuff in the household work" with the gender role of women as housekeepers, but you can also attempt to associate "making stuff work in general" with the gender role of men as mechanical tinkerer types, so there's really no clear gender stereotype in this that I can see.

    Of course, if you're looking to force it as an issue just for trollface purposes, then you could run it either way, obviously.
  • "you duck spawn, refined creature, you try to be cynical, yokel, but all that comes out of it is that you're a dunce!!!!! you duck plug!"

    I have some ideas on how to pull it off, but the last time I trolled for teh lulz it felt, frankly, unfulfilling. Thought it would be funnier, now I'm pretending it's all according to plan. Perhaps I'm not cut out to be a professional troller.

    Concerning the on-topic stuff: in general, I prefer to spend a while jury-rigging my stuff, than bothering with going out and buying it. The more so if it mostly works, apart from some quirks. The exact proportion of laziness to cheapness depends on the case under discussion.

  • edited 2015-10-08 23:36:55
    I'm confident I've seen at least one /r/Tumblrinaction entry about a feminist claiming that fixing things is a men's/patriarchal thing.
  • Creature - Florida Dragon Turtle Human
    What exactly does this "[foo]inaction" name mean? I've seen KotakuInAction (i.e. GamerGate) and now you mention Tumblrinaction.
  • KotakuInAction sprung off from TumblrInAction, which is a reddit about mocking (mostly) dumb SJW related posts (not necessarily from Tumblr).
  • Creature - Florida Dragon Turtle Human
    Oh I remember the specific action that made me make this thread.

    I was gonna give him a game on Steam.  It was a bundle key that I could turn into a giftable link.  I sent him the link.  He didn't redeem it then and there, and this was a few weeks ago.  Then I was looking back through my stuff and I was like, wait, he still hasn't redeemed it yet.
  • JHMJHM
    Here, There, Everywhere
    I find such fora exceeding dubious, to say the least. Sure, every sane and sensible social justice type on Tumblr is aware of the crazies, and there is fun to be had at their expense; but the kind of people who obsess over that sort of thing tend to be the sort of crypto-reactionary morons who unironically state that feminism has done its job in the West and pre-op transwomen are just whiny crossdressers. They are so, so much worse than the misinformed teenage prats they single out as evidence of the fall of civilisation.
  • edited 2015-10-17 04:16:28
    Diet NEET
    They are mostly misinformed teenagers and bachelor students overconfident that they now understand the world, if age surveys on both ends are any indication. They waver between the belief the world is forever going to the shitter due to social justice/crypto-fascism and celebrating that the tide is already turning for the other party, who is inevitably on the wrong side of history: https://popehat.com/2012/03/12/the-difference-between-us-and-them/

  • JHM wrote: »
    I find such fora exceeding dubious, to say the least. Sure, every sane and sensible social justice type on Tumblr is aware of the crazies, and there is fun to be had at their expense; but the kind of people who obsess over that sort of thing tend to be the sort of crypto-reactionary morons who unironically state that feminism has done its job in the West and pre-op transwomen are just whiny crossdressers. They are so, so much worse than the misinformed teenage prats they single out as evidence of the fall of civilisation.
    A couple of years ago a friend of mine came home from military college to visit and was making fun of "Tumblr feminists" and how lame they were. At the time I indicated that I agreed with him, of course drawing in my mind a strict line between "Tumblr feminism" and the good kind. It quickly became clear that he drew no such line, and for a long time he used "Tumblr feminists" as a strawman to attack basically anything vaguely feminist that he didn't like, such as: people getting upset at him for saying "politically incorrect" things at a gaming store in another city, fantasy novels having female characters in them, etc.

    I pretty much lost all interest in joking about Tumblr around that point.
  • Ehh, I'm not seeing that's the case for TiA. Sure, it has a significant number of quasi racist/misogynst/whatever (or wholly racist/misogynist/whatever), and no, they don't get as criticized as they probably should (then again, I never pay attention to downvotes), but by my experience the majority of those shitlords see it as the past-time that it is, who are aware of Tumblr past the SJW parts, who don't see SJ activism as a threat to society or anything, and more importantly, who are aware of the non-stupid side of SJ arguments and it's not their job to educate others but are willing to share that knowledge with curious passerbys in a way that's relatable to those who are only aware of the theme park version of these arguments. I know between all those lost toucans I've learned a couple things.

    Also, they're just as quick to jump in favour of a trans person being unjustly attacked by other SJWs as they are to feature them saying silly things.
  • He who laments and can't let go of the past is forever doomed to solitude.
    everything sounds worse when adding crypto- to it.
  • "you duck spawn, refined creature, you try to be cynical, yokel, but all that comes out of it is that you're a dunce!!!!! you duck plug!"

    ^ For a while I thought, except for "the Wonder Dog". But then I realized it's actually much worse than many other cases.

    Anyways I've got a couple of things to say at the moment, with a better or worse relation to the topic. I guess I'll keep them to myself until I'm sure they add something meaningful.

  • Crypto reactionarism -> Reactionarism from the crypt.
  • Ehh, I'm not seeing that's the case for TiA. Sure, it has a significant number of quasi racist/misogynst/whatever (or wholly racist/misogynist/whatever), and no, they don't get as criticized as they probably should (then again, I never pay attention to downvotes), but by my experience the majority of those shitlords see it as the past-time that it is, who are aware of Tumblr past the SJW parts, who don't see SJ activism as a threat to society or anything, and more importantly, who are aware of the non-stupid side of SJ arguments and it's not their job to educate others but are willing to share that knowledge with curious passerbys in a way that's relatable to those who are only aware of the theme park version of these arguments. I know between all those lost toucans I've learned a couple things.
    I've never been to TIA so I can't say anything about it in particular; I was just talking about the "lol look at these tumblr kids" attitude in general. I've just seen that "haha tumblr sj is dumb" -> "haha feminists deserve to be raped" transition happen before, both with my former friend and with parts of the internet in general. Somewhere along the line, "Tumblr activism" went from being something specific to be mocked to being a way to strawman anyone at all with socially progressive leanings. For instance there's a trend among the gamergate types where people will insist that "SJW" still only means the silly otherkin-rights kind of people, but then use the term to label anyone who disagrees with them, no matter how calmly or reasonably.
  • Oh, you're certainly right in being suspicious of these attitudes (I was mostly referring to JHM's post), but as with everything, exceptions abound.
  • He who laments and can't let go of the past is forever doomed to solitude.
    Isnt that Motte-and-Bailey on gg types?
  • when you're talking about groups rather than individuals, the concept of motte and bailey should be applied much more carefully.
  • What timing. TumblrInAction is undergoing a meltdown right now, so however one sees it right now, it (and the now public /r/tumblrpls) will probably be quite different in a couple weeks anyways.
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